tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post112279233296866217..comments2023-10-10T03:21:23.580-04:00Comments on Motown Sports Revival: Active Hall of Fame PitchersJakehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16208921021297172480noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123355254402831402005-08-06T15:07:00.000-04:002005-08-06T15:07:00.000-04:00Well, it seems to me that the only three stats tha...Well, it seems to me that the only three stats that even matter about a pitcher are wins, era and strikeouts, with strikeouts really meaning didly squat. If Brown has a better era than schilling and more wins, that makes him a better pitcher hands down. It's simple. All that other crap about whip's and oba really don't mean anything, so they shouldn't even be brought up in a discussion. Is it better to give up a double and walk two but no runs, or a solo homer. Maybe to Tony, the solo homer looks better. Anyways, I agree that it is a joke that Jack Morris is not in the Hall. He was one of the premier pitchers of the 80's and early 90's, which is a long time, certainly long enough to get into the hall.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123345744904598872005-08-06T12:29:00.000-04:002005-08-06T12:29:00.000-04:00I don't agree with your argument line. A 70 win d...I don't agree with your argument line. A 70 win discrepancy in wins is huge. I see Schilling's lifetime stats and consider everything that was said but Morris should be compared to Schilling for a number of reasons. They both were elite pitchers in their generations and both deserve consideration for Cooperstown but in my opinion, Morris is more worthy. I will not think differently unless Schilling completes his career with three or four seasons of being one of the best. Talk to you in 2009.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123343011792432292005-08-06T11:43:00.000-04:002005-08-06T11:43:00.000-04:00You're barking up the wrong tree comparing Morris ...You're barking up the wrong tree comparing Morris to Schilling. Morris has Schilling beat in one important category and that's wins. Complete games are irrelevant in in this day and age. Schilling led the league twice in innings pitched. Morris led the league once. The only reason to mention CG's is if you're implying that Schilling didn't go deep into games. This is not true. I would take that any day over complete games. Your point that Morris' ERA would've been a run lower if he pitched in this age holds no weight. Schilling actually averages more innings per start than Morris did and Morris pitched in an era when starting pitches threw more innings! So if you're saying Morris' ERA would've been lower had he only pitched 6 innings per game, then you have to say Schillings would be too.When I say that Schilling has Morris beat in every important stat, I'm talking important stats, not complete games or shutouts. It's not even close. Schilling has been by far the better pitcher. In every measurable way, Schilling beats Morris. It's not Schilling's fault that he was on the same team as Randy Johnson and Pedro Martinez. That has nothing to do with this. How does that make Schilling any less of a pitcher? Compare their numbers. Don't get in to someone being a #1 starter. If Morris and Schilling were on the same team, Schilling would easily be the number one starter. I wouldn't be saying anything if the numbers were close. But, they're not. Schilling is far and away the better pitcher. Here is a comparison of Schilling to Morris. <BR/><BR/>ERA<BR/>Schilling 3.32<BR/>Morris 3.90<BR/><BR/>ERA compared to league average<BR/>Schilling 24% better<BR/>Morris 4% better<BR/><BR/>Whip<BR/>Schilling 1.11<BR/>Morris 1.30<BR/><BR/>Winning percentage<BR/>Schilling 60.0%<BR/>Morris 57.7%<BR/><BR/>Batting average against<BR/>Schilling .237<BR/>Morris .247<BR/><BR/>Post-season wins<BR/>Schilling 7<BR/>Morris 6<BR/><BR/>Post-season ERA<BR/>Schilling 2.06<BR/>Morris 3.80<BR/><BR/>Cy Young runner up<BR/>Schilling 3<BR/>Morris 0<BR/><BR/>Strike outs per 9 innings<BR/>Schilling 8.8<BR/>Morris 5.8<BR/><BR/>SO to BB ration<BR/>Schilling 4.30<BR/>Morris 1.80<BR/><BR/>If you want to measure complete games and shutouts, you have to put them in context to the era that each pitcher pitched in. CG's and SO's were different when Morris pitched. If you want to compare, compare how each player did with relation to the league. <BR/><BR/>Times led the league in complete games:<BR/><BR/>Schilling 4<BR/>Morris 1<BR/><BR/>Times finished in top 3 in Complete games:<BR/><BR/>Schilling 9<BR/>Morris 7<BR/><BR/>Times finished in top 3 in <BR/>Shutouts:<BR/><BR/>Schilling 4<BR/>Morris 2<BR/><BR/><BR/><BR/>If you want to talk about Morris' credentials for the Hall of Fame, I suggest you compare him to someone like Tom Glavine. I have no problem making a case for Morris being in the Hall of Fame. However, I do take issue with the belief that Morris was better than Schilling. It's just not close. I understand you want Morris in the Hall of Fame but that doesn't change the fact that Schilling has been a much better pitcher than Morris. <BR/><BR/>When I say that Morris has a 0% chance of making the Hall of Fame, I'm not saying I think he has no argument. I'm saying that he will not be voted in by the voters. He doesn't even come close on the yearly Hall of Fame ballots. <BR/><BR/>Here are the voting results for Morris. You need 75% to get elected. Morris doesn't even have half the needed votes. <BR/><BR/>Jack Morris<BR/>Year Election Votes Pct <BR/>2000 BBWAA 111 22.24 <BR/>2001 BBWAA 101 19.61 <BR/>2002 BBWAA 97 20.55 <BR/>2003 BBWAA 113 22.78 <BR/>2004 BBWAA 133 26.28 <BR/>2005 BBWAA 172 33.33Jakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16208921021297172480noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123338455603464882005-08-06T10:27:00.000-04:002005-08-06T10:27:00.000-04:00Babe Ruth? 0 percent chance? Come on. Wins (70 ...Babe Ruth? 0 percent chance? Come on. Wins (70 more), complete games (double), world series wins, and remember oh wise one...Schilling has never been a #1 starter. He was a distant #2 behind Randy Johnson and red ankle or not, Pedro Martinez was the man. His chance is this year. We'll see. Morris was #1 on the Tigers and Twins and #1A beside Dave Stewart with the Jays. Also remember, and you may be too young, that Jack Morris was known to throw right down the pipe when he had a three run lead and say hit me. He was eating up innings and if he was a modern day player having to only pitch six before the set-up, set-up guy comes on, his ERA would have been a run lower. Think about it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123310866188964362005-08-06T02:47:00.000-04:002005-08-06T02:47:00.000-04:00Jack Morris won 20+ games three times. He was the ...Jack Morris won 20+ games three times. He was the winningest pitcher of the 80's. He won three world series which included the unbelievable 10 inning shutout. There are two things keeping him out. 1)His winning percentage is only .577 and 2). His career ERA is 3.90. The league average throughout his career was only 4.08. Just to put that in perspective, Curt Schilling's career ERA entering the 2004 season was 3.32. The league average throughout his career has been 4.34. Schilling gives you 24% off the league ERA average. Morris gives you 4% off the league ERA average. It's really not even close. Schilling has Morris beat in every category except for wins. And as far as who I'd want on my team, you'd have to include Babe Ruth with Jack Morris for me to pick him over Schilling. Morris might have somewhat of a case for the HOF but not at the expense of Schillng. These are two completely different arguments. Morris was a big game pitcher. However, there's a 0 percent chance Morris makes it.Jakehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16208921021297172480noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123279105505652252005-08-05T17:58:00.000-04:002005-08-05T17:58:00.000-04:00Candidates eligible for future elections for the f...Candidates eligible for future elections for the first time through the BBWAA vote include: 2006: Will Clark, Dwight Gooden, Ozzie Guillen, Orel Hershisher, Walt Weiss and John Wetteland; 2007: Harold Baines, Jose Canseco, Eric Davis, Tony Gwynn, Mark McGwire, Paul O’Neill, Cal Ripken, Jr., and Bret Saberhagen; 2008: Shawon Dunston, David Justice and Tim Raines; 2009: Mark Grace and Matt Williams; 2010: Edgar Martinez and Robin Ventura.<BR/><BR/>Where the hell is Brook Jacoby?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123277843577894822005-08-05T17:37:00.000-04:002005-08-05T17:37:00.000-04:00Oh but you think it's just because Jack was a Tige...Oh but you think it's just because Jack was a Tiger? Step. Goose Gossage was the most dominate closer this side of Mariano Rivera and there gonna put Bruce "three piece" Sutter in next year? What about Lee Smith? <BR/><BR/>Gossage had more saves, more playoff moments, and invented the modern day mold of a closer. Lee Smith has 178 more saves than Bruce Sutter! 178! I just can't believe that Gossage who was feared and admired would be passed over for Bruce Sutter who outside of those fireman awards contributed nothing to baseball folklore. I'm just sick. Lee Smith would be behind Gossage on my list but both deserve a spot before that stiff Sutter. Don't get me started.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123276685077628972005-08-05T17:18:00.000-04:002005-08-05T17:18:00.000-04:00Look, I don't want to hear anything about Curt Sch...Look, I don't want to hear anything about Curt Schilling and the Hall of Fame. What a farging joke. JACK MORRIS!!!! JACK MORRIS!!! If Jack Morris and his 254 wins, 2500 K's, 3800 IP, 175 complete games, and three world series rings where he was the #1 pitcher on two teams isn't in, then Schilling shouldn't even be considered. Did Schilling throw a ten inning complete game shutout in Game seven of the World Series? No. I am not going to sleep well until Jack gets in and if guys like Schilling or God help us, Kevin Brown gets in...I'm gonna puke. I'll fly to the ceremony and puke. <BR/><BR/>Smoltz is in as well because of his postseason stats and I agree with all of Jake's guys. Talking about anyone who is under thirty is somewhat futile to me but whatever. If this was 1981 we'd be talking about how Mike Moore, Floyd Bannister, and Bob Knepper were on their way to the hall. That just doesn't work. <BR/><BR/>But to reiterate, no talk of Curt Schilling or anyone of his ilk should be considered for the HOF until Jack Morris is bronzed. YOU HEARD?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13718554.post-1123270461103759742005-08-05T15:34:00.000-04:002005-08-05T15:34:00.000-04:00I don't know about some of this. I agree, Schilli...I don't know about some of this. I agree, Schilling will probably make the Hall because of his reputation, but Kevin Brown seems to have him beat in a lot of stats. If Schilling gets in, Brown sort of has to by comparison. That makes me think that once people look at Schillings numbers, he may not get in. Also, Halladay is a tremendous stretch. I will be shocked if he gets in. I agree that he is awesome, but he has a lot of padding the stats to go to even have a chance. Finally, Mark Mulder has a legitimate chance if he remains with the Cardinals and has a long career. He will post 20 wins for the forseeable future in that organization. Who knows though.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com